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Comments 2017

Moore

A message from Pamela McKirdy in Wellington, New Zealand …

I am interested in a Joseph Moore born about 1820, son of William Moore and Ruth Davis of Shipley. Joseph was transported to Tasmania in 1845.
I would like to know what became of him, because he could be the same person as my husband’s ancestor who lived in Hobart, Tasmania in the 1850s.
The Tasmanian Archives have his convict records which list his age (born around 1822) and say he was from Shipley Wood, Nottinghamshire. One of the documents lists his brothers and sisters: Jeremiah, John; Mary, Martha, Sarah, Margaret, Fanny, so I’m confident he is a brother in the family of William and Ruth. His occupation was “collier” but I think that was the work he was doing in Tasmania. He was transported on the Ratcliffe 1845 ex London. One of his tattoos said “SIHB” (I have no idea what that might stand for), and his crime was desertion from 32 Regt 5 ….(hard to read!).http://search.archives.tas.gov.au/ImageViewer/image_viewer.htm?CON14-1-20,338,311,F,52

I would really like him to be my husband’s ancestor Joseph Moore born 1819-1821 in England and living in Hobart from at least the mid-1850s, but so far I can find nothing that might connect the two men, apart from their ages and that they were both Methodist. Joseph the Convict was a tall man for his time and Joseph the Tasmanian’s son was also tall. Unfortunately the Tasmanian marriage and death certs don’t list parents.
If anybody can help I would be very grateful. (February 28th 2017)


Tatham

Lizzie Jane Tatham was my grandmother. My mother was born in 1894 and lived to be 109. It seems that the family did not know of her existence. I do not think I ever met my grandmother though my mother did know her in spite of having been brought up by foster parents
V. Cole (March 12th 2017)


In reply to V Cole.

Thanks for this, ‘V’
There would seem to be quite a lot of family history here !!?

Dave (March 13th 2017)


Hello Dave
Re. the recent article on Allen Tatham.
Just an idea, but if you look at the picture of Edmund Tatham Jnr. in your section Flints.. On the East Side. He does look very like the second image of the persons unknown. He is, of course, Allen’s brother who withdrew from the company. Just a thought. Have compared them side by side to reach this thought.
Billy Boy


Reply … thanks Billy Boy ….. certainly a possibility.
It seems that photographer Henri Louis Morel (born abt 1859 in Boulogne sur mer) married in Nottingham in 1883 and was working there from the mid- 1890’s onwards.
Dave (March 12th 2017)


Smith

Fascinating material. My Grandfather, Joseph Smith, was born and bred in Ilkeston. His father was named William. The family eventually moved to Edlington, Yorkshire, to work in the newly sunk mine, Yorkshire Maine. Both William and son Joseph worked there: my Grandfather until he retired, nearing 70! He often spoke of The Flowerpot P.H. Have you come across any material re the family. With Thanks, William Birch. (March 13th 2017)


In reply to William Birch.

William,
I’m afraid I need a bit more information … it is not clear what period you are asking about.
The newly sunk ‘Yorkshire Maine’ might suggest some time in the early 20th century?
A few dates would help … especially with a name like Smith !!

P.S I think I may have identified your Joseph Smith … born at 8 Tutin Street, Ilkeston on February 26th 1891, the son of William and Elizabeth (Richards)
The parents were married in 1886 at Babbington Chapel in Nottinghamshire.
This was after Elizabeth had given birth to an illegitimate daughter Sarah Richards later known as Sarah Smith .. most probably William was the father.
Sarah was the first of at least 10 children (up to 1911)

Mother Elizabeth was born at Grass Lane, Ilkeston on Sep 18th 1866, the daughter of coal miner Samuel and Harriett (Chapman).

The Smith family spent most of their Ilkeston life in Chapel Street or Chapel St Row .. and so would be well-acquainted with the Flower Pot Inn a one minute walk from their home !!

I won’t go on as this may be the wrong family !!

Dave (March 13th 2017)


In reply to Dave.

Sorry for delay, as I have been away. Thank-you for the information, and the time you have spent on the research. . I think that you have the correct family. William Birch (April 23rd 2017)


Simpson

Hi,
My name is Donna. I am researching the Simpson family from Ilkeston …Willoughby and Mary (Hardy) who had Willoughby jr (who married a Harriet (Hardy)) … my great grand parents x5.
Any information would be great regarding their parents please
Thanks Donna (April 6th 2017)


Hello Dave,
It’s been a little over a year since you helped me immensely with my Ilkeston ancestors, for which I am very grateful.
Lately, my research has been stalled. I seem to be hitting brick walls everywhere I turn and so I took a little break. But I guess that’s all a part of the journey of genealogy!
Today, I decided to hop on the site after being away for a time and I noticed a post by “Donna” in April of this year and it turns out we must be distant cousins as Willoughby Simpson is her 5x’s gr grandfather and my 4x’s gr grandfather. I was so surprised… I could hardly believe it.
I have left a reply to her post, but as she doesn’t appear to have been back since her post, I was wondering if there is anyway you have of contacting her? I know part of leaving a comment is leaving your email address and I didn’t know if that was available to you?
I would really love to “compare notes” with her and I wondered if there’s any way you are able to contact her through her email? I will keep checking back either way in hopes that she may see my reply to her.
Thanks so much,
Brenda Sweeney (June 30th 2017)


In reply to Donna.

Hello Donna,
I was very surprised to see your post today! Willoughby and Mary Hardy were my 4x great grandparents! Willoughby Jr and Harriet Hardy were my 3x great grandparents! But like you, I’ve been unable to find Willoughby Sr’s parents as of this date. I realize your post is almost 3 months old here, so I’m not sure if you will even see my reply. I do hope so! I would be very interested in communicating with you, if you wouldn’t mind, to compare some notes possibly?
I’m not sure of any other way to contact you, so I do hope you see this message.
Brenda Sweeney (June 30th 2017)


Brocklehurst

Edward Brocklehurst is my great-grandfather and his brother Enoch is my great (grand-)uncle.

My grandma is Alice May Brocklehurst Bamford, the illegitimate daughter of Edward Brocklehurst and Florence Bamford. On her birth certificate, the birth date is shown as 5th May 1920 at Greasley, Basford, Nottinghamshire, (mother Florence Bamford , domestic servant and living at Bennerley Cottage, Awsworth , father Edward Brocklehurst); the birth was registered on the 8th June 1920.

Edward’s name is on this certificate although there is a line through it, and someone (I’m guessing Edward) has visited on the 12th June and had the registrar put a line through his name … to hide his ways perhaps ? I have a copy of this birth certificate, but I had to apply for it myself as my grandma destroyed most related document.
Edward never married Florence … and he didn’t hang around for long either !!

However my grandmother kept some contact with Edward …. he was at her wedding for example , and I know that she did attend his funeral … he lived (his later life) in Huddersfield and I know he died in the 1950’s (1954?) … I have a newspaper cutting of his death.

My grandma was very secretive about Edward and now I think I understand why; I only have one picture of Edward in his later life and its stamped foreign office in the corner.

I have been trying to solve the secret of why my grandma never spoke about her father, or kept any documents or photos … rumours were of someone doing wrong but we thought it to be a brother of my grandmother (whom we have no proof existed)

My grandma Alice married Bernard Taylor on Christmas Eve, 1940 … it was a register office wedding… the marriage will probably have been in either Doncaster or South Elmsall which is where Bernard was from.
My father is their son, Keith Taylor, an only child, who died 13 years ago, aged 56 years.

My grandma Alice often saw Edward’s brother Enoch and his wife … they often came to visit my grandma …. he’s the only relative we have pictures of, and my dad remembers his wife seeming a bit ‘stuck up’

My grandma Alice died in 1993 (Sheffield District)
There’s speculation that she also had a brother called William (Billie) born to her parents Florence and Edward , but I can’t seem to find evidence he really existed.
Physically, I do have Edward’s nose and my grandmother looked a lot like him. I must say he wasn’t the brightest of criminals and he didn’t seem to learn his lesson … I wonder if he continued into old age thieving and ‘womanising’ ??

This is an edited version of the emails Natalie (Smithson) has sent (May 17th – May 20th 2017) ….


Harrison

Hi Dave,
I am researching my Harrison side of my family.
There is a lot of stories from different members but I have recently spoken to my cousin who believes that our Harrison’s started in Derbyshire. Four children … the only dates I have are for twins William and Joseph born in 1830 to a Thomas Harrison and lived in Hollinsclough. The other two children were Sarah and Thomas. Joseph moved to Manchester and got married to a lady called Alethea and he was a spirit dealer and inn keeper.
I have tried to research the Harrison family for a while as we are all on Merseyside and i have not found the link. If I can help anyone and they can help me I would be really grateful
Regards
Victoria Hardy (June 7th 2017)


In reply to Victoria Hardy.

Victoria,
It looks like twins William and Joseph were born on May 3rd 1829 at Hollinsclough, and baptised at Longnor, Staffordshire on Apr 2nd 1843 .. sons of Thomas, a brewer, and Sarah.
Sarah was born at Birmingham, Warwickshire, about 1791.
As you say Joseph moved to Manchester and on the 1851 census is living there with his unmarried brother Thomas (aged 33, born in Hereford)
Joseph married Alethea Davies, (daughter of Edward and Elizabeth?) in 1852 at Manchester .. she was also born in Herefordshire, at Lyonshall?
From the census, it seems that father Thomas the brewer died between 1851 and 1861 and that mother Sarah died after 1861, (perhaps in Manchester?)

As yet I cannot see a connection between this Harrison family and Derbyshire … perhaps your cousin has more clues?
However I will post your request on the site .. in the Harrison families (see Comments summary) and in the ‘Help‘ section (June 7th 2017)


Bostock

I am researching a tree for a friend and I have just established that Emma Bostock and Thomas Davis married at Bath Street Methodist church in 1870 (source findmypast). What I would really like to know is who Emma’s father was. As I am struggling to find any further information about her prior to her marriage. According to census returns she was born in Mosbrough. I am hoping you may have access to these records? Many thanks in anticipation.

Sandra (June 13th 2017)


In reply to Sandra Ibbotson.

Sandra,
Thomas and Emma were married at the Wesleyan Methodist Chapel on South* Street on June 6th 1870.
My viewing of the census (1871-1911) shows that Emma was born in Ilkeston … I believe she was the daughter of John and Christiana (nee Hart) and born on May 19th 1848.
She appears in Ilkeston on the 1851 and 1861 censuses as Emma Bostock.
(If you probe the children of Thomas and Emma, especially their daughter Ada, born on June 30th 1881, you might find a connection to the Johnsons of Ilkeston)

*corrected from Bath Street (June 13th 2017)


Attenborough

Good afternoon,

I am tracing my ancestors the Attenboroughs’. George Attenborough left Ilkeston to travel to South Australia in 1825, his father being John Attenborough born in 1800. George’s daughter Elizabeth is my great-grandmother. I have found the Old Ilkeston site has been most helpful in describing their way of life and occupations.

I am writing to request a digital image of The Sir John Warren Hotel (34) and also permission for its use.

The reason I am request this is that I am putting together information relating to my English ancestors for my immediate family. My intention is that the information will be for my family only and not for general distribution. To be able to use the image on your www page would add to our understanding of the type of buildings of that period. If a digital image is available the quality will be much better. Acknowledgement of your assistance will be shown.

Jeanene Schapel (June 17th 2017)


SM

Hello,
Just a quick question. In regards to the information you have on burials of people in Ilkeston what does SM mean under ‘place of burial’?

Dave replied …

It refers to ‘St. Mary’s Church’, the parish church in Ilkeston, where most (but not all) of the dead of Ilkeston were buried, until the General Cemetery in Stanton Rd, Ilkeston, was opened in 1864.
I should have provided a ‘key’ for the entries … it will appear ‘shortly’ !!

Julie then replied …

Thanks (July 16th 2017)


Beardow

Hi!
My grandmother, Millicent May Pashley (nee Beardow) was born in 1928 in Ilkeston to Henrietta Beardow and a Sidney Kerry. She had nothing to do with her father as she was illegitimate and does not recall anything about him.
We would like to know more information about her maternal grandparents. Frank Brown Beardow (a Bargee) and Clara Beardow (nee Tompkins). Any information on any member of the family would be great! Millie (as she is more commonly known as) is well and still manages to travel to Cyprus every year to visit her daughter, grandchildren and great grandchildren!
She has fond memories of her school years and recalls her classmates Gladys Kerry, Jean Toplis and Maureen Swan at Chaucer school (1937-1939) as well as Kath Butler, Kath Becket and Jean Wheatley from Bennerley school (1942 leavers)…. Nicky Stavrides (August 11th 2017)

From Dave … I will post a reply in the ‘Comments Summary’ (under the Beardow family)


Nunn

Hello,
I am looking for the school my G G Grandfather first worked at when he moved from Ipswich to Ilkeston.
His name was William Nunn. I know he worked at Little Hallam but have no idea the name of schools from the area,I have been told there was a Sanatorium on Long Field Lane but again do not know if he would of taught there ?He did end up being the Relieving officer for Ilkeston and surrounding areas,taking local people to the Basford Workhouse ,Nottingham on his pony and trap…. Sue Fardon (August 19th 2017)


Sue,
It appears that William came to Ilkeston in the mid or late 1870’s
I have discovered a note in the Nottingham Journal newspaper (Jan 21st 1876) stating that William had just been appointed Relieving Officer to the Basford Union, having previously been schoolmaster at the Basford Union Workhouse … his place as schoolmaster was then taken by John William Hope previously of Carlisle.
From 1881 William is described as relieving officer, so it appears that he would only have a few years as teacher.
In Ilkeston in the 1870’s there were two main schools only … the British Schools in Bath St. and the National schools (see the section on Education in Ilkeston)
Dave (August 19th 2017)


Hi Dave
I have been researching my family for several years and you have solved a mystery for me – thanks you!
I am a descendent of Henry Tomlinson, who you wrote a fascinating piece about: he’s my great great grandfather ( I think? His daughter Ellen was my mother’s grandmother) and I have been puzzling over who Henrietta was as she’s so much older than Ellen, who I thought was her sister. My mother recalls having two great aunts, Hannah and Kate. Are these the other two children Henry had with Mary Hannah do you know? I had come to the conclusion Kate may have been a cousin (daughter of Henrietta?) but can’t remember why I thought that.
So pleased I found this site. I hope to visit Ilkeston some day to explore properly.
Many thanks … Julia Fogarty (August 22nd 2017)

Julia,
I have posted a reply to your comments at ‘Tomlinson family‘ in the Comments Summary section. (August 22nd 2017)


Harrison and Winfield

Hi, I’ve been researching the Winfield branch of our family and am wondering if Lucy Harrison (born 1785 at Crich) who married George Winfield in 1807 at Ilkeston, is the same person as Sarah Harrison (also born in 1780s at Crich)…

Sarah appears with husband George Winfield in the 1861 Census and according to the Ilkeston ‘Independent’ baptism records was mother to his children Ann (born 1814), George (1819) and Sarah (1821).

Lucy and Sarah each have significant gaps in their genealogical record that the other neatly fills, and with no overlaps that I’ve found. However, that’s still only circumstantial evidence, and I’d really like to find a contemporaneous record that indicates Lucy and Sarah are actually one and the same.

If you know of such a thing, or can shed any other light on this puzzle, I’d be delighted to hear of it. Lucy is a direct ancestor, and it would be great to learn more about her.

This site, incidentally, is a brilliant example of what all communities could be aiming to achieve. … Ken Taylor (September 30th 2017)


In reply to Ken Taylor.

Ken,
I recall looking at this issue some years ago when I started to put these records together … and the conclusion I came to then was that Lucy and Sarah were the same person, not finding any evidence to contradict that conclusion (of course, ‘not finding evidence’ is not the same as ‘no evidence exists’ !!)

In this reply I include detail which you are no doubt aware of but which others may read and perhaps offer their own ideas ?

George Winfield’s wife seems to have started and ended her life as ‘Lucy’
She was baptised as Lucy Harison at Crich in 1785, daughter of Thomas (and Ann (nee Harrison) ?)
She married George as ‘Lucy’ on Dec 26th 1807.
She died as Lucy Winfield on Feb 9th 1876 at Ebenezer Street, Ilkeston, aged 92, when she was described as the’widow of George Winfield, framework knitter’, her son George being present at the death. She was buried at St Mary’s Church on Feb 11th.
However as you point out Ken, George’s wife is at times referred to as ‘Sarah
She is ‘Lucey’ at the baptism of her children in 1814, yet ‘Sarah’ at further baptisms in 1822 and 1824.
On the 1841 census she is Lucy and in 1851 is Sarah, and back to Lucy in 1861 and then Sarah in 1871. The proximity of Winfield children on these censuses suggests that Lucy and Sarah are the same person.
I find it difficult to believe that different people made the same ‘mistake’ in recording her name as Sarah at significantly distinct times. My conclusion is that she may have referred to herself as ‘Lucy Sarah'(not a combination of names that crops up a lot ?) or simply ‘Sarah’
All circumstantial and inconclusive I am afraid.
Perhaps if George had left a will ??

Dave (October 2nd 2017)


Simpson

hi Dave well the family tree has grown a bit but i have a question did Charlotte die age 4 ? ive been for my first trip round St Marys found a couple of Simpsons but no Willoughby sr a little disappointed i think i may have found Harriet’s parents but need a little more digging and its also turned up the Issac was a freemason with one of his brothers ! still digging but any help would be great.

thanks, Donna (October 15th 2017)


In reply to donna croule.

Donna,
I’m glad to see that your tree is growing.
Charlotte Simpson was buried at St Mary’s Church on Mar 8th 1837, aged 4 years. I am presuming that this is the same Charlotte born to Willoughby and Harriett in 1832.
I am only too willing to try to help … if there is anything specific you want to investigate.

Dave (October 16th 2017)


In reply to Dave.

hi Dave, i’ll be back to St Marys at the weekend as i missed part of the grave yard its charlotte really as i have found one on ancestry that fits but she moved to East Leake and had lots of children i thought she died too. and Willoughby snr married to Mary Hardy is proving difficult I think I found Mary’s parents Richard and Mary .

thanks Donna (October 19th 2017)


Scattergood

Hello again Dave,
You have been most helpful in the past with my Scattergood family. I’m hoping you might be able to assist me once again.
My Gr Grandmother, Harriet Scattergood married Walter Green in 1874 in Nottingham. I don’t believe Walter ever lived in Ilkeston but it appears, according to the 1851 census, that his parents and 2 brothers did. It shows his older brother Joseph Green actually born in Ilkeston abt 1843-1844. I cannot find any info other than that census about the Green family. Walter and Joseph’s parents were John Green and Elizabeth nee Hufton. This is according to Walter’s birth certificate. There appears to be a marriage for John Edward Gree(m) and Elizabeth “Houghton” in Ilkeston in Nov 1841. I’m wondering if this might be Joseph and Walter’s parents? Different spelling of Hufton/Houghton plus Greem instead of Green so maybe a stretch?
If you can shed any light on all of this I will be most grateful.
I do hope all is well with you and hope to hear from you soon.
Thank you Dave!
Brenda Sweeney

Dave replied …
Brenda,
John Edward Green and Elizabeth Houghton (also found as Hofton/Hufton/Huffon etc etc !!) had an illegitimate son John Hofton (alias Green) born on Aug 26th 1837 at Ilkeston .. the child died, aged 10 days, on Sept 4th 1837. At this time Elizabeth had a sister called Hannah Hofton.
This suggests that John Edward — born in Quorndon about 1812 — was around Ilkeston at this time. On the 1841 census Elizabeth Houghton/Hofton — born about 1817 at Langley, Derbyshire — was living at Pimlico with John and Hannah Aldred.
Both John Edward and Elizabeth were framework knitters. They married at St Mary’s Church just after the census was taken, on Nov 21 1841 as you suggest — the father of Elizabeth was William, while John Edward’s father was John.
John Edward and Elizabeth then had an unnamed son born on Jan 3rd 1842 at Ilkeston … he died 3 days later on Jan 6th 1842.
Their son Joseph was born on Oct 12 1843 at Ilkeston and it seems that the Green family then cut their links with Ilkeston and moved firstly to Earl Shilton, Leicestershire, where sons William (1846) and Walter (1856) were born.
Then the family moved to Carlton, Nottingham, where they are found on the 1871 and 1881 censuses.
The son Joseph, born at Ilkeston, married Sabina Seagrave/Segrave on Jun 29th 1868 at Gedling (neighbouring Carlton) .. he later traded as an ‘elastic/surgical bandage maker’. Sabina traded as a draper in Carlton.
I believe Joseph died in 1897 while Sabina died in 1906. There don’t seem to have been any children.
Son William was in the same trade as his older bother. He married Eliza Whitehurst at Gedling on Mar 9th 1878 and then continued to live in Carlton. There were 10 children, seven surviving.
And then there is, of course, Walter …
I hope this fills in a few gaps for you.

Brenda replied …
Oh my goodness Dave!! Thank you ever so much for all of this information!! Much more than I had ever thought there would be. I don’t know where you find all of this information but I’m so happy you did! I like the way you added … and then there was Walter. Walter has turned out to be a real surprise in what I have learned about him. As I mentioned he married my Great Grandmother Harriet in 1874. I found them in the 1881 and 1891 census records living in Nottingham but then Walter went missing from the census record in 1901 with Harriet shown as head. I thought perhaps he had died but not so as he was back listed in the 1911 census as head of the family. I eventually learned that he had gone to America in 1885 and was employed as an elastic bandage maker living as a lodger presumably in a boarding house! Eventually his son Walter Jr joined him there to work also. I’m sure there were trips back and forth to England for both of them as Walter Sr had 6 more children after 1885. However I find it very strange that for over 15 years he lived pretty much separated from Harriet. But those seem to be the facts!
Again Dave, thank you so very much for all of this wonderful information! Take care…

Brenda then added …

Hello again Dave,
Just a quick clarification if you could please? In adding the information to my tree that you so generously provided, I was just a little unsure about the 1841 census where Elizabeth Hufton is living with John and Hannah Aldred in Pimlico. If I’m reading your info correctly I think you’re saying that Hannah Aldred was Elizabeth’s sister? It appears that Hannah Aldred is 63 and Elizabeth is 20. It seems like quite an age gap between siblings. I might be misunderstanding the information.
I’m also wondering if you know if either of the “William Huftons” shown in the 1841 census might be Elizabeth’s father? ( that may help me with Elizabeth’s mother’s name possibly then)
Thank you again for all your help.
Brenda

Dave replied …
Brenda,
Apologies if I am confusing you.
Elizabeth Hufton, aged 20, is at Pimlico with the Aldreds but I am not suggesting that she is in any way related to them.
Hannah Aldred was born Hannah Hopewell, daughter of Samuel and Ellen (Chambers) … also at the same address is William Hopewell who is probably Hannah’s brother.
As Elizabeth Hufton was born at Langley, her family probably had connections with Heanor as much as Ilkeston. I know she had a sister Hannah … and there is a Hannah Hufton, daughter of William and Sarah (Birkimshire/Bircumshaw) born in Langley in 1814. This William is a framework knitter and his daughter Hannah married John Paxton (Nov 6th 1837) at St Mary’s Church … who should be one of the witnesses but ‘John Green’ !!
Dave

Brenda replied …
Hi Dave,
No apologies necessary… it doesn’t take much to confuse me these days! I believe I have it all sorted now with Hannah and John Paxton. And oh my goodness… John Green was a witness! Wonderful!

Thank you once again for being so generous with your time and knowledge!

Kindest regards
Brenda (November 9th 2017)


Pre-1841 Censuses

Hi Dave. 🙂

I was wondering if there is any information on the Ilkeston censuses taken between 1801 and 1841, where one is likely to find such info if there is any, and if so, whether you plan to publish it on this site.
Cheers,
J.

Dave replied …
J,
It seems as though the pre-1841 censuses for Ilkeston are ‘lost’.
I have never located them and they don’t seem to be held anywhere.
As you are probably aware, they were generally little more than ‘head-counts’ and are of very limited use to family historians. After a statistical summary had been made the central authorities, most of the returns of the local census enumerators were destroyed (very few survived).
You will find more detail about them at the website familyhistory.co.uk which list all pre-1841 censuses for every county including Derbyshire
Sorry.
Dave (November 16th 2017)


From Jé Maverick.

Thank you, Dave, that’s a wonderful resource. I don’t suppose you have any info on local lock-ups, circa 1791-1792? Was there a lock-up in Ilkeston, or would local offenders awaiting trial at the Derby assizes be detained in Derby Gaol itself?

Cheers, J (November 24th 2017)


In reply to Jé Maverick.

J,
I have copied this from the website …
In the lower Market Place stood a block of buildings formed from the Butter Market and the National Schools, and also containing the local Lock-up called the ‘Round House’ — which was square — where accused persons would spend the night before being transported to the Petty Sessions at Smalley, or to Derby.
This block stood under the north Church wall, approximately on the site now occupied by the present-day toilet building and was directly opposite Thomas Merry’s business premises. It was open along its front, protected only by iron railings.

You will find a picture also on the site at ‘The grand tour — Education in Ilkeston — the Old Market Hall

Dave (November 24th 2017)


Haseldine family of Ilkeston

Thank you for a wonderful web site. I have been searching the 1841 census for the Hasledine family in Ilkeston on Ancestry and Find My Past to no avail. However, 2 minutes on Old Ilkeston and I found them living in Bath Street. Thank you so much. You also give information as to Elizabeth Hasledine nee Blackshaw and her mother and father’s names. Is it ok for me to ask how this was possible with such little information given on the 1841 census? Am I missing something on your website.
Kind regards,
Helen


Dave replied …
Helen,
It is ok for you to ask anything !! (especially as it is Christmastime) .. though I can’t always guarantee satisfactory answers.
As you write, this Haseldine family appears at Bath Street on the 1841 census (which is notoriously vague).
So the best bet is to see if you can find them on the 1851 census and fortunately there they are, at Walsall, with an Ilkeston connection … son Samuel, born in Ilkeston about 1826 … and his baptism appears at St Mary’s Church, Sep 23rd 1826.
Father Richard was born at West Hallam about 1805 .. and there is a baptism of Richard Haseldine at St Wilfrid’s Church, West Hallam, dated Nov 17th 1805, son of Joseph and Mary.
So then you look for a marriage of Richard and Elizabeth around or before 1826 and there is one at St Mary’s Church, Ilkeston, dated Nov 21st 1824.
The bride is Elizabeth Blackshaw, who was born about 1805 in Chaddesden near Derby (according to the 1851 census) … she could have been a widow at the time of her marriage to Richard but looking at these dates the odds are that she was a spinster.
There is a baptism of Elizabeth Blackshaw at Chaddesden on May 26th 1806, daughter of Samuel and Mary. These parents had other children dating from 1800 to 1813 (baptised at Chaddesden) and so looking for a suitable marriage around 1800 … there is one at Chaddesden for Samuel Blackshaw and Mary Elliott on Jun 3rd 1799.
The 1861 census shows the family still at Walsall, and confirms the places of birth and approximate birth dates … and shows an increasing family.
You could argue that this is all circumstantial !!
So, in short, the 1841 census does give little information but it is a starting point.


Helen replied …
Dave,
You are a star…….thank you for all that information. I never for one moment even expected you to reply.
You must be “”Mr Ilkeston” you know so much about the town and it’s people. You have confirmed everything for me and also started me thinking as to how I can get further details of the marriage of Richard and Elizabeth and the baptism of their son Samuel. Do you know how I can obtain photocopies of the actual parish registers – do I need to go to the Records Office in Matlock. Because of all the wonderful details you have given me I guess I should be able to find them if I go there.
I know Ancestry have just released some of the Derbyshire parish records on line – it is truly wonderful to see the actual registers with all the handwriting of the participants. However, I couldn’t find anything for the Haseldines in Ilkeston.
Thank you again Dave for helping me to get over that Brick Wall………….


Dave replied …

Helen,
If ‘Ancestry’ cannot help, you may have to visit the Records Office. To avoid the travel you might email them to see if the staff there could copy the record you want, giving precise details. (December 14th 2017)


Frost

Hi Dave,
have just found your website, it’s superb, many thanks for all the useful information.
I am related to the Frost family, and I would be interested in getting in touch with Lionel Frost who supplied the photo of the Frost family. Thomas Frost and Mary Graham are my g-g-g grandparents; William’s brother Eli Frost was my g-g grandfather. I have a photo of Eli and his wife that Lionel might be interested in, and I would like to ask Lionel if he can send me a better copy of the Frost family photo that is on your website.
Many thanks. Kate Miller. (December 17th 2017)


Winfield family/Crich link (info from Alan Smith)

Also worthy of note is… At the time of Richard’s birth in 1811, his mother is Lucy, yet on the 1871 census his mother Sarah is living with him and his family, this also points to Lucy and Sarah being one and the same person.

Also of interest is how; on the 1871 census alone: Sarah’s place of birth is the village of Heage rather than Crich, a distance of about 4 miles between the two.

Here’s a link to website you might be interested in while researching Crich ancestors, its the Crich Parish website:
http://www.crichparish.co.uk/

and if you wish to look at individual surnames, the link is:
http://www.crichparish.co.uk/indexwebpages/church.html

In addition to the children Lucy/Sarah and George Winfield had in Ilkeston, I also found a record on the IGI of baptism for a Mary Ann who was baptised in Crich 23rd May 1809 of George Winfield and Lucy.

Good luck with your research. Alan (December 21st 2017)


Bostock info from Alan Smith (in reply to Brian Bostock).

Hi Brian, when it comes to the subject of old maps, the National Library of Scotland has a brilliant website (of English OS maps from the 1880’s onwards); for which I’ll attach the link below.

You’ll see the screen is split into two panes, Old maps on the left and New (Bing) maps on the right, both work with each other insomuch that as you zoom in or out on one map, the other map does the same, it’s a brilliant researching tool to have when tracing ones ancestors, so give it a go and I’m sure you’ll agree.

Alan (December 28th 2017)
http://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=14&lat=52.9742&lon=-1.3097&layers=6&right=BingHyb


‘Lost’ John Severn in 1841

Hi Dave, I’d rather like to ask through these pages if anyone has any information on one John Severn of Ilkeston with regards to the 1841 census.

John was Christened on 6th March 1816 in Ilkeston to William Severn and Phoebe Leggitt, I know he was married to one Emma Ride of Muggington/Weston Underwood in 1838 and together they had two children; Matilda who was born in 1839, and John who was born in the 4th quarter of 1840.

Emma and her young son (John) both died in 1841 prior to the census of that year being recorded, I know that their daughter Matilda was living with her re-married grandmother Pheobe (who’d married Thomas Bennett), but its the whereabouts of Matilda’s father (John Severn) I’m after as he seems to have disappeared – it must have been hard for him after losing his wife and son.

From what I’ve found out, Matilda never lived with her father again, but John did live in Ilkeston as he’s found on the 1851 and later census. I’ve looked to see if John went to see his wife’s parents in Muggington/Weston Underwood, but he’s not listed with them, so I’m out of ideas of why to look for him.

Alan (December 28th 2017)