Thomas Frost … the prequel (by Alan Smith)

(In affectionate memory)

Born in 1807, Thomas Frost was the son of labourer John Frost and Elizabeth (nee Warren).
John and Elizabeth appear on the census for Ilkeston until 1861 and their entries show that John was born in Uttoxeter about 1780. He died at Kensington on April 19th 1861 when his age was recorded as 81.

Alan Smith has continued his research into this family and I thank him for offering his findings to the site.
Most of this section is the result of Alan’s work. He writes …..

Parish records (IGI) tell of John being christened on the 10th September 1780 in Uttoxeter, Staffordshire, to a William Frost and Elizabeth, with John being the eldest of four Frost children born in Uttoxeter to the aforesaid William and Elizabeth, his siblings being; Nathaniel, Thomas, and Elizabeth.
(I believe that there was a later sibling — Charles — baptised May 29th, 1791 at St Mary’s Church in Uttoxeter)
When it came to looking into John’s parentage there was an immediate stumbling block — by looking on the various genealogy websites it became clear that there were two Frost families within ten miles of each other, in which children were being born to a William Frost and Elizabeth — that were having children in the three locations of Checkley, Uttoxeter, and Marchington.
(Checkley is 6.5 miles from Uttoxeter which is 3.5 miles from Marchington)

This table shows the baptismal details of these children. 

Checkley Uttoxeter Marchington
Sarah 5 Mar 1769 John 10 Sep 1780 William 28 Jan 1776
Dorothy 1 Sep 1771 Nathaniel 28 Jan 1782 Mary 29 Jun 1777
Thomas 24 Oct 1773 Thomas 22 May 1785
William 19 May 1777 Elizabeth 16 Dec 1787

Who were the parents  …
at Checkley ?
By looking online for a marriage for a William Frost and Elizabeth in or around the village of Checkley about 1768, details of two marriages were shown, the first being on 7th November 1768 when William Frost married Elizabeth Morry, the second marriage being two years later on 22nd November 1770 when William Frost married Elizabeth Hollins.
As there is an eighteen month gap between the births or baptism’s for the first tow children of this family, I felt that it was possible that Elizabeth (Morry) had died, and to help care for his young daughter, William married Elizabeth Hollins.

at Uttoxeter ?

at Marchington ?
By looking online for a marriage for a William Frost and Elizabeth in or around the village of Marchington about 1775, the only viable entry I found was that of William Frost marrying Elizabeth Cliff on the 13th February 1775 in Rugeley.
Perhaps Rugeley isn’t considered to be local to Marchington, but they’re only about 12 miles apart, and the timing of the marriage fits very nicely, and besides, I found no trace of them living in Rugeley but I did find baptisms for them in Marchington.

So there we have it, two families in three locations, both families being parented by a William Frost and Elizabeth.  We know by looking at the above table, that it’s not just one William and Elizabeth moving about because of the similar baptismal dates of the children, and given the dates of birth for John and his siblings it’s obvious that either the Checkley or Marchington family moved into Uttoxeter from their ‘original’ location, the question being “Which family moved?”

Knowing that one of the families must have moved was one thing, trying to prove which family moved is something else.  As can be seen in the above table, I’ve looked at marriages for William and Elizabeth but found no real solace there; so what else was there ? .. there had to be a clue somewhere.  Could that clue come from the names given to John’s children in Ilkeston? The easy answer is no; time to put the thinking cap back on.

The first thing that yielded me a clue as to John’s parents was after I’d begun to look into John’s possible siblings, and the discovery of a date of marriage for Dorothy Frost (bap 1771 at Checkley) gave me a hint.
Dorothy was married to John Beadmore in Checkley on the 9th February 1793.  Dorothy and John had at least four children in the Checkley/Upper Tean area.  This seemed suggested that Dorothy hadn’t left Checkley, and if that was the case then it’s a strong possibility that neither did her parents, and if that was the case then the four children born in Uttoxeter weren’t her siblings and neither were they children of William and Elizabeth from Checkley.

As for her sister Sarah, her marriage is unproven, but there were two Sarah Frost’s who were married in the Stoke on Trent area c1796, and with Stoke on Trent being the opposite direction from Checkley than Uttoxeter is, I saw that as another pointer as to the Uttoxeter children not belonging to the Checkley family.

Feeling that I may have found the proof I needed to discount the one of the families as the ‘Uttoxeter Frosts’, I then looked for marriages for the children, William and Mary from Marchington.

My first search was for Mary, and lo and behold I found a record of marriage between Mary Frost and Richard Bentley (12th July 1802) in Uttoxeter, this straight away suggested that it was the Marchington Frost’s rather than the Checkley ones who had moved into Uttoxeter.  As for her brother William, the results of my research for him suggested that he was married in the Ashbourne area of Derbyshire, just ‘top side’ of Uttoxeter, this seemed to be a double confirmation of the Marchington family becoming the Uttoxeter family.

The jigsaw that was the question of John’s parents was at last (at least in my mind) solved; all that remained to be done was to discover more about John’s parents — William Frost and Elizabeth Cliff.

As I wrote above, the baptisms of John’s parents were found to have taken place in Marchington (details below), but knowing this made me wonder why William Frost and Elizabeth Cliff were married in Rugeley. There are of course several reasons why this might have been such as: Employment (for we know nothing about that) / Did Rugeley keep the parish registers  ? But marry they did, and so we must take note of it and carry on with the research.

Here then are the details of William Frost and Elizabeth Cliff’s baptisms:

               William Frost                Elizabeth Cliff
Baptised:              25th Nov 1744, Marchington

Parents:                William Frost & Elizabeth

Baptised:                20th Sept 1744, Marchington

Parents:                  William Cliff & Elizabeth

Note how the parents of both William and Elizabeth are William and Elizabeth!  How much more confusing can this become?

The above William Frost and Elizabeth Cliff had several children, details of which have been previously detailed in the table presented earlier, so we can now look into their parentage and siblings.

William Frost and Elizabeth; parents of William Frost (bap 1744)

My research into father William revealed that he was baptised on 20th December 1719 in Edlaston, of George Frost and Ann. However trying to find a marriage for him proved inconclusive as the only one I could find anywhere near Marchington for a William Frost took place in Marchington on 11th July 1744, four months before the baptism of William in November, however, while the record of William’s baptism (and that of his siblings) speak of their mother being Elizabeth, the marriage I speak of here was between a William Frost and a Mary Jackson, I’ve been unable to find/prove a marriage between a William Frost and an Elizabeth.

Children of William Frost and Elizabeth (with dates of baptism)

William (Nov 25th 1744); Elizabeth (Jan 20th 1745); Thomas (Sep 6th 1747); Henry (Mar 17th 1748);Ellen (Aug 26th 1750); Ann (Dec 27th 1751); John (Nov 3rd 1754); Charles (Aug 15th 1756); Hannah (Dec 20th 1760)
All baptised at Marchington.
Not being able to prove who exactly their mother is truly vexing.

William Cliff and Elizabeth; parents of Elizabeth Cliff (1744)

Searching the IGI, I found a record of a William Cliff marrying Elizabeth Bartram on 17th January 1741 in Kingstone, Staffordshire; about 5 miles from Marchington, this record of marriage speaks of William Cliff being born in 1719 but doesn’t specify where.  There is however a record which I found on the IGI that speaks of him being born and married in the village of Hanbury which lies about 4 miles east of Marchington.  Apart from Elizabeth, the only other child born to William and Elizabeth Cliff (that I’ve found) is Mary; she was baptised on 27th June 1742 in Marchington.

George Frost and Ann; parents of William Frost (bap 1719)

George Frost was baptised in Kirk Ireton on 30th March 1687, first child born of George Frost and Mary French
George married Ann Starlin in Edlaston on 27th September 1718

Children of the marriage (with dates of baptism)

William (Dec 20th 1719); Joseph (Jul 19th 1722); Ann (Jul 27th 1723); Elizabeth (Dec 28th 1725); Sarah (Dec 28th 1727); Ann (Oct 20th 1730); Mary (Nov 20th 1732); John (Jun 8th 1734).

All baptised at Edlaston, Derbyshire.

George Frost and Mary; parents of George Frost (1687)

George Frost was born sometime in the 1660’s, at present his parentage is unproven.
George married Mary French in Wirksworth on 3rd June 1686

Children of the marriage

George (Mar 30th 1687); Helen (Jun 9th 1689); Mary (Sep 2nd 1691); Sarah (Aug 31st 1692); John (Sep 17th 1696);   Margaret (Jun 11th 1697); William (Mar 31st 1699); Millicent (Sep 19th 1697 unproven)
All baptised at Kirk Ireton, Derbyshire.

As George’s parentage is as yet unproven, termination of the Frost family must take place at this point in time.

Continuing Frost

I’d previously halted this family tree at George Frost (born c1660) because of one thing; that being my inability to prove his parentage, the reason for this was due to discovering two George’s being christened within 6 months of each other in 1664 and 1665 in the Ashbourne area.  Two births therefore yield two sets of parents…

The options are:
1 Christened 20th November 1664 (of Fenny Bentley, near Ashbourne), born to George Frost and Jane Rogers
2 Christened 22nd January 1665 (of Ashbourne), born to Richard Frost and Dorothy (maiden name unknown)

Both sets of parents (as listed above) were married in 1663:
1 George and Jane Rogers were married 11th September 1663 (Fenny Bentley, near Ashbourne)
2 Richard and Dorothy were married in 1663 (Ashbourne)

1 Children of George and Jane Rogers
George (20th November 1664 Fenny Bentley), William (20th November 1664 Fenny Bentley) – Note: Same baptism date

2 Children of Richard and Dorothy
Thomas (1664 Ashbourne), George 1 (1665 Ashbourne), William (1666 Ashbourne), Dorothy (1671 Ashbourne), Richard (1673 Ashbourne), George 2 (1678 Ashbourne)
The discovery of two George’s being born to Richard and Dorothy actually goes some way to eliminating this family as parents/siblings of ‘our’ George Frost.

When it came to naming children ‘way back when’, there was an old custom that… in case of the death of a child… the next same sex child received the same name given to the one who had died, and it was this that gave me the pointer I needed to feel confident in stating who George’s parents were/are.

You’ll note that Richard and Dorothy had two sons named George, one in 1665, the second in 1678.  Based upon the old naming custom previously spoken about, this would imply that the George who was born in 1665 died sometime between 1673 (after the birth of his brother Richard) and 1678 (the birth of the George 2), therefore George 2 who was born in 1678 can’t (by nature of his birth/age) be the one who married Mary French in 1686.

There is now only one option remaining, and that’s the one I’m going with, it is the union of George Frost and Jane Rogers in 1663, and I’ve listed their two children previously.

To continue with the Frost lineage, I needed to look for more about George Frost.  We know he married in 1663, so therefore he’s got to have been born sometime in the 1630’s/1640’s, and this was duly found in the year A.D.1640 with him being born to George Frost and Ann (of whom I’ve been unable to find a surname).

The IGI shows George and Ann as having several children in the villages of Cubley, Edlaston, and Kirk Ireton:

Elizabeth 1 (1622 at Cubley), Joseph (1627 at Edlaston)), Marie (1628 at Edlaston), George 1 (1632 at Edlaston), Elizabeth 2 (1638 at Kirk Ireton), George 2 (1640 at Kirk Ireton), Margaret (1648 at Kirk Ireton).

George and Ann must have married (if indeed they did for I’ve not found confirmation of such a union taking place) about 1622, the year Elizabeth 1 was born.

George was born c1590 in Ashbourne to William Frost and Susannah Allsoppe, one of nine children I’ve found whose parents were the aforesaid William and Susannah…

Helena (1587), Robert (1588), Helena (1589), George (1590), Thomas (1592), Henry (1594), James (1596), Anna (1598), Jane (1600).
All born at Ashbourne
… but from what I’ve discovered, George’s father was married twice, this makes George as being one of 14 instead of nine.

William Frost (born c1549, Ashbourne, Derbyshire)
Marriage 1 Alice Bircumshaw, Ashbourne, 2nd October 1575
Children of William and Alice
Ricardus (1577), Edmundus (1578), Radulpus (1579), Thomas (1581), Johannes (1585) … all born at Ashbourne.
Marriage 2 Susannah Allsoppe, Ashbourne, 18th January 1587 (children listed above 1587-1600)

Here again ends the Frost family ancestry for I’ve been unable to find any parents for William Frost.

But thanks to Kate Miller we can widen our view of the Frost family                                or the Home Page